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2. Do you recollect whether Rivett had a contest with Mr. Fergusson before he got to Lord Thanet ?
Ă. Not to my observation ; I had seen none.
2. From the situation in which Mr. Fergusson was, could Rivett have got a stick out of Mr. Fergusson's hand?
A. I think, if he had had a stick in his hand, he might; I obferved no stick in his hand.
2. Could he have struck him, and wrested the stick out of his hand, without your sceing it?
A. I think not.
2. Was Mr. Fergusson any part of that time in the place allotted for the Solicitors ?
Q. Was he ever nearer to Mr. O'Connor than the place for the Counfel?
A. Never ; I was between them.
Q. During the whole of this time, did Mr. Ferguson at all appear to encourage the tumult? A. Quite the contrary, I think.
Cross-examined by Mr. Law. Q. You have faid that Mr. Fergusson, fo far from encou. raging this tumult, acted quite the contrary?
Q. Am I to understand you, that he endeavoured to dissuadę. them from riot ?
A. I heard bin fay to Mr. O'Connor, “ Be quiet, and keep your place; nothing can hurt you."
2. Was that after the acquittal?
A. It was after the verdict of acquittal had been given, and before the sentence was passed upon O'Coigly,
2. But after the sentence was pronounced, did you observe Mr. Fergusson doing any thing that was quite the contrary?
A. He seemed to fay, “Be quiet ;' and, from Mr. Ferguson defiring him to keep his place, and having complained to the Court of a person that wished to make a tumult, he appeared to me to be a person who wished to keep every thing quiet and in order,
Q. You have told us, that, during the whole day, Mr. Fer, gusson kept the same place ?
A. As to the same place, I believe he might have moved to the right ; he might have been, perhaps, to the right of Mr. Plumer in the morning ; but what I mean is, that he never moved out of the place where the Counsel fat,
: Q. Then he must have been under your own-observation the whole of the day?
A. Yes. 2. Did he never appear to be upon the table in the course of that day?
A. While the Jury were retired, he went across the table, and, I believe, went to speak to somebody near the witnesses' box; but at that time people were conversing and walking about, but there was no idea of a riot then.
2. Will you say, after the verdict was brought in, he was never upon the table ?
A. He was never upon the table that I know of, 'till he was preffed upon by the Bow-ftreet officers,
Q. Did you, during the day, see a stick in his hand, or that he had not had a tick ?
A. I will fwear that I did not fee a stick in his hand.
Q. And you had him so much under your observation, that you must have seen it?
A. As much as a person could do, sitting in a Court of Justice; it was quite ridiculous to suppose he had a stick in his hand.
2. Was you a witness, or concerned in that trial ?
Q. And you will swear that he never had a stick in his hand ?
A. I will fwear I did not see a stick in his hand ; and I think I must have seen it, if he had.
Q. If you had him constantly in view, you must ?
A. It cannot be fupposed that I had my eyes upon him for fourteen hours.
2. WILL YOU VENTURE TO SWEAR, THAT DURING THE RIOT HE HAD NO STICK?
A. I WILL.
A. Lord Thanet moved, as Mr. Ferguffon did; upon being pressed upon, he got up upon the bench ; and that, when he moved up, Rivett was above him, and trying to strike him; and Mr. Fergusson then said, “Who are you Atriking, Sir?”
Jury-Whether he saw Lord Thanet, during any part of the period, near the the wicket-gate that leads to the narrow street ?
A. I saw Lord Thanet, I think, during the whole riot ; and I think, instead of being there, he went, when he did move, quite the contrary way, and not at all towards the gate. Mr. Juftice Lawrencz-From Mr. Ferguffon- complaining
of a tumult, it seemed as if he wished to keep every thing in order ; who was the person that he complained of?
2. At that time was he not making use of this motion, (describing it), and say, "Keep back, where are you going?"
A. Yes; and I think Mr. Justice Buller then said, “What is the matter? Mr. Ferguifon then said, “Here is a person making a noise, and will force himself into the Court." Mr. Justice Buller then said, " What do you mean, Sir ?" He then faid, “ My Lord, I have a warrant against Mr. O'Connor." He then told him to keep back.
Mr. Warren / worn, examined by Mr. Mackintosh. 2. I believe you was present at the trials for high treason at Maidstone ?
A. I was.
2. After fentence was pronounced upon O'Coigly, tell us what you observed of the confusion that arose in the Court? 4. After the sentence of death was pronounced upon
O'. Coigly, the first part of the affray that I recollect was this : Mr. O'Connor endeavoured to get out of the dock : he got almost out of the dock, on the left side; the gaoler, who was on the other side of the dock, reached across the dock, and caught him by the coat : he detained him for a very short space of time in that situation ; the coat tore, or flipped through his hands.
Q. At that time, when the gaoler had hold of Mr. O'Con. nor's coat, did any body reach or step backwards between them? A. Nobody. Q. Then Mr. Ferguson did not?
A. Certainly he did not.-Mr. O'Connor got away, either from the coat being torn, or flipping through the geoler's hands; he got down upon the ground; he soon inixed with the crowd, and I loft sight of him : as soon as he endeavoured at first to get away, two persons, who had before appeared to be officers from Bow-street, with several others, rushed forward to apprehend him. In their endeavour to apprehend him, the first person upon whom they appeared to rush with afly great
violence, was Mr. George Smith, who was sitting at the end of the seat of the Solicitors for the prisoners : he was forced from thence, and came to the place where I was fitting. The next person that I observed forced from his feat, was Mr. Dallas, one of the Counsel for the prisoners ; he came likewise and fat near me ; the officers still rushed on towards the end of the Counsels' feat, and of the Solicitors' feat. At the farther end of the Counsels' seat, or ne:r the end of it, Mr. Ferguffon was sitting, to the best of
recollection. Q. Had be a fick in his hand? A. No stick that I faw.
Q. Had you your eye upon him; and if he had; must you have seen him?
A. He is an acquaintance of mine, and he was in his profeffional dress; and if he had, I think I could not have mistaken it : Lord Thanet was fitting upon the Solicitors' bench, almost immediately behind Mr. Fergusson. By this time the confufion had become general, and a number of people had got upon the table, from all parts of the Court.
Q. Whether, if Mr. Ferguffon had brandished a stick, or presented it to Rivett, mult you have seen it?
A. I certainly muft. & I need not ask
did see it! A. I did not see it'; Mr. Ferguffon had risen up, and Lord Thanet had risen up.
2. Supposing it possible that a stick had been in Mr. Fer. guffon's hands, and it had escaped your eye, do you think it possible, from time and place, that Rivett could have wrenched it out of his hands before he attacked Lord Thanet?
A. I do not think it poflible he could have a stick of any fort.
Q. Was Lord Thanet nearer to Rivett than Mr. Fergusson?
A. I think he was rather ; one of the officers, but I do not know which, I do not know their persons, pressed very rudelys as it appeared to me, upon Mr. Ferguson ; I believe that Mr. Ferguson might fake his shoulder when he felt the man's hand upon it; that is all the resistance I saw made on the
part of Mr. Ferguson.
Q. What did you see pass between these officers and Lord Thanet?
A. The first thing I observed particularly of Lord Thanet was, that he was lying almost down upon his back upon the table, with a small dick or cane, which he held in both hands over his head or face, in this manner: one of the officers was striking him with a stick, and Lord Thanet endeavoured, with - very little success, to defend himself by the use of this stick, which he held in both his hands. Q. Now, before that period of which you laft spoke, did you.
obfervé Lord Tharet give a blow, or any provocation, to this oficer?
A. I never saw him give a blow; I never faw him give any provocation; I never saw him in
than I have mentioned, till he left his feat; how he left his seat I cannot tell; they had risen up upon their feats ; when they were pressed upon, they rose towards the left hand side of the prisoner, as the prisoner faced the Judges.
2. Did they go out of sight?
A. They were not upon that table; Mr. Ferguson was upon the table afterwards, but not on the table at any time that I have yet spoke to Lord Thanet was then lying upon the table. I am not able to say how Lord Thanet got from that fituation ; I do not know that I took particular notice of what pafled after, with respect to Lord Thanet ; Mr. O'Connor was brought into Court, and then the riot ceased.
Q. Did you take any particular notice of Mr. Fergusson, between the last time you have been speaking of, and the time of Mr. O'Connor being brought into Court?
A. No: I do not recollect any thing more.
2. I need not ask you if you faw Mr. Fergusson brandish a (word ?
2. Did you see Mr. Fergusson after the sentence of death was pafled, go back to his old place?
A. I did not.
A. They were, most particularly : I was placed in a situation in which I could very well fee.
Q. So that it was impossible for Mr. Fergusson to have gone backwards from his feat, without having ftruck your eye?
A, I think it was impossible.
Q. Did you see Mr. Ferguffon apon the table, before Lord Thanet was beat by Rivett?
A. I did not.
A. Under the witness-box; I rose from thence, and got upon the table as other people did.
Mr. Mackintosh-Did you fee Lord Thanet or Mr. Ferguffon take any part in any thing that had the appearance of disturbance or riot ?
A. No; I did not. I saw Lord Thanet defend himself; and I have stated, that I did not see Mr. Ferguffon do any
act at all, except thaking that man's hand off his shoulder.