NATO-WARSAW PACT GROUND FORCE COMPARISON (IN PLACE IN EUROPE-1984)' NOTES: WARSAW PACT DIVISIONS NORMALLY CONSIST OF FEWER PERSONNEL THAN MANY NATO DIVISIONS BUT WARSAW PACT TOTALS EXCLUDE THE 17 STRATEGIC RESERVE DIVISIONS IN THE MOSCOW, VOLGA AND 'EXCLUDES FRANCE AND SPAIN. THREAT General WAGNER. The principal reason we have to put dollars into research and development and in acquisition is because in every major fighting system, tanks, anti-tank weapons, artillery, armor fighting vehicles and attack helicopters, we are outnumbered 2 to 3% or 4 to 1. We have been that way for years. Mr. CHAPPELL. Is that an acceptable posture? General WAGNER. We don't think it is. I will show you some improvements we have made. This doesn't include France. If you add France in, you get about 1,500 tanks which don't make an appreciable difference and 5,600 fighting vehicles, again not an appreciable difference in the overall balance. [Slide follows:] PRODUCTION OF GROUND FORCES MATERIEL USSR/NSWP AND NATO* *REVISED TO REFLECT CURRENT TOTAL PRODUCTION INFORMATION. INCLUDES UNITED STATES: EXCLUDES FRANCE AND SPAIN. NSWP IS NON SOVIET WARSAW PACT. General WAGNER. What worries us is the modernization rate of the Soviet and their Warsaw Pact allies and then compare it with NATO. Again you can see they are outproducing us at 3 or 4 to 1, too, in these principal items. The key to this is that these Warsaw Pact items are good pieces of equipment, on a technological level almost as good as what we are putting in the field today so we have to make sure we keep up the momentum and keep ahead of them if we can. Mr. CHAPPELL. The right column is what? General WAGNER. This is a total of what the NATO nations produced last year. For example, in fighting vehicles, they produced a total of 1,760, tanks, other armored fighting vehicles, 2,230. Mr. CHAPPELL. How many did we produce? General WAGNER. We produced 820 of those tanks, so about half as many as the total NATO forces did. Mr. CHAPPELL. Are you saying that this is our NATO production- General WAGNER. Yes, sir. Mr. CHAPPELL. Is the left line the USSR production? General WAGNER. This is the USSR and this is the non-Soviet Warsaw Pact. So you add these two together and you get what would be facing us in Central Europe, 3,650 tanks produced last year. Some were produced in Poland, some in Czechoslovakia. They are Soviet-designed tanks, but they produce them there. Mr. CHAPPELL. Are they producing 3,650 against our total NATO production of 1,760? General WAGNER. That is right. Mr. CHAPPELL. And we are talking about tanks? Mr. CHAPPELL. In other armored fighting vehicles, they are producing 4,800 per year. We are producing a total of 2,230. General WAGNER. Yes, sir. Mr. CHAPPELL. And towed field artillery, they are producing 1,850 and we are producing 425? General WAGNER. Yes, sir. Mr. CHAPPELL. Do you have a chart that shows what the total numbers are now? General WAGNER. No, sir. I don't have the total numbers. If you count all their tanks, they have 40,000 to 45,000 in that part of Central Europe. We have about 15,000, about 3 to 1. The ratio hasn't changed appreciably in total tanks. Mr. CHAPPELL. Dr. Sculley, good to have you with us. Mr. SCULLEY. I apologize for being late. Mr. CHAPPELL. That is all right. We are getting good testimony anyway, Doctor. That is what the General said anyway. General WAGNER. They told me to go ahead. Mr. SCULLEY. I think we are on the same wave length, sir. [Slide follows:] |